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Restoration Beyond the Couch
The Beyond the Couch with Dr. Lee Long podcast is intended solely for general informational purposes and does not represent the practice of medicine, therapeutic and psychiatric services, nursing, or other professional health care services. It also does not constitute the provision of medical, therapeutic or psychiatric advice, and no doctor/patient relationship is established. The information on this podcast and any materials linked from it are used at the user's own risk. The content provided through this podcast should not be considered a replacement for professional medical, therapeutic, or psychiatric advice, diagnosis, or treatment. It is important that users do not ignore or postpone seeking medical, therapeutic, or psychiatric advice for any health or mental health condition they might have, and should always consult with their health care professionals regarding such conditions.
Restoration Beyond the Couch
Transforming Trauma: How Scarcity and Gratitude Fueled His Path To Triumph
Have you ever wondered how someone can transform a traumatic past into a future filled with hope and innovation? Join us for an intimate conversation with Michael Menard, the acclaimed author of "The Kite that Couldn't Fly and Other May Avenue Stories." Growing up with 13 siblings in a tiny home in Kankakee, Illinois, Michael's story is a powerful testament to resilience and the profound impact of a nurturing environment, even amidst generational trauma. His journey from adversity to a best-selling author will leave you inspired by the human spirit's ability to find strength in the darkest of circumstances.
In this moving episode, Michael opens up about his struggles with understanding and reframing his childhood. Initially led astray by mental health professionals who painted his past as a bleak landscape of adverse childhood experiences, Michael found himself spiraling downward. With the steadfast support of his wife Emily, he turned to trauma recovery literature and narrative therapy, ultimately rediscovering his youth with fresh clarity and resilience. Through his unique storytelling, we learn how he found beauty in his past and the transformative power of re-writing one’s narrative, painting a picture of hope and renewal.
But Michael's story doesn’t end there. From building a kite with his mother that couldn't fly to inventing the disposable diaper and securing 15 patents, his early inventive spirit shines brightly. This episode delves into how scarcity and gratitude forged his path to innovation and success. Highlighting the crucial role of community in healing and preventing childhood trauma, Michael's anecdotes underscore the importance of a supportive environment in overcoming adversity. Tune in for an inspiring discussion on resilience, innovation, and the collective journey towards mental wellness.
Learn more about Michael and 'The Kite that Couldn't Fly: https://thekitethatcouldntfly.com/
Welcome to Restoration Beyond the Couch, hosted by Dr Lee Long. In this episode, dr Long interviews Michael Menard, best-selling author of the Kite that Couldn't Fly and other May Avenue stories. Michael's memoir recounts his remarkable journey from a challenging childhood filled with poverty and trauma to a life of resilience and hope. As one of 14 siblings, his story is a powerful testament to overcoming adversity. Michael, who co-founded the GenSight Group, a consulting and software company advising major corporations like Coca-Cola and NASA, now focuses on helping others overcome childhood trauma through his writing. Living in Tennessee with his wife Emily, he is a proud father of five daughters and grandfather to nine grandchildren. Join us as we delve into how Michael's life and work inspire others to find strength in their struggles and hopes for their futures. Your path to mental wellness starts here.
Speaker 2:Mike Menard Lee live in person. I'm so glad you're here.
Speaker 3:Happy to be here, Lee. Thanks for inviting me Absolutely.
Speaker 2:So you, such a phenomenal storyteller, thank you Wrote this amazing book. I will say it's amazing. It's an amazing book called the Kite that Couldn't Fly and other May Avenue stories. So tell us, tell our listeners, where was the inspiration behind the book time frame here.
Speaker 3:I'm 73 now, so we're going to go back here. You know 73 years I was. I was born in a small town South of Chicago, kankakee, illinois, and I'm one of I'm the second oldest of 14 children and we grew up in a, a tiny house, a 900 square foot home, so just think of 30 foot by 30 foot, 16 people at the end.
Speaker 2:When I read that in the book, I have to tell you that blew my mind. I mean, I think about how I like my space and hearing that you had because you had 10 brothers and you have 10 brothers and 10 boys, four girls.
Speaker 3:So, yeah, yeah, all the same. All the same parent, the same parents, no twins, um, as you said earlier, that's 14 pregnancies. Yeah, yeah, um. And when people find out that my mother had 14 children, she would say, oh God bless you. And she says he did 14 times. She saw each as a blessing. So some people have large families out of ignorance. My mother loved children and she, when it came time to end her childbearing years, she had two miscarriages in a row and her doctor finally said. I was in the room with her and he said Mrs Menard, you have to stop having children, your body's falling apart. And she said he will decide when I stop having children, not you, not me. And he had decided. So, yeah, she, um, she was an awesome mom. So I I was. I was blessed with this angel of a mother who loved us and loved Jesus.
Speaker 3:And we also had a father who was shaped by his own trauma that introduced in addition to the poverty because we were below the poverty line. He exerted classical childhood trauma through physical beatings and the very wrong lessons. He also taught some great lessons. I want to honor that. You can imagine the stories that come out of that environment, that environment. And we had a mother who was so interesting and allowed exploration and openness and believed that we were born to be great children of God. So all the confidence building in the world. But we had a father who suffered from confidence and would oppose my mother, would pose the good uh, not intentionally, but it was just he. He had a, he had a, a frightful childhood, um, and that's just an example of generational trauma that flows through.
Speaker 3:So all these stories on on my parents 40th anniversary, we had the idea of each child getting up and telling their favorite childhood story and it was a hoot and I remember writing them down on a napkin as my oldest brother started telling the story. So I collected the 14 stories and I thought, oh, this should be a book. Well, that was 30 years ago. So I continued to tell what I have called forever the May Avenue stories and I focused on the good ones. I focused on the ones that brought smiles to people's faces. But I also started collecting memories from my siblings and myself, but all, all memories that I was part of. So it's the older group that that are that are included in this book. And so I started collecting the stories, the good, the bad and the ugly, and um, always expanding my standup comedy routine with these stories, cause it can bring people to tears from joy. It can bring, it can bring belly laughs, and these are things you just can't make up. But again.
Speaker 2:I'm probably going to state this a few times as we talk today. You're a phenomenal storyteller and I think that you have a way of bringing out aspects of what has, what has occurred, and some of some of the stories as, as you read them in the book, you think, oh my gosh, you know, I mean, the one that stands out to me is the uh, the mouse mittens, you know, and, and because what stands out in there is that your mom was giving you guys the, the uh, the latitude to kill mice in her home.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Harvest, right, harvest, yeah, yeah, and then skin them and then knit or sew together to make a pelt, yeah, and that you are making mittens for yourselves, like I mean, there's just so much through there that you could. You could take so many different viewpoints with that. So many different experiences, like your vantage point, I guess I should say, could be so different by telling that story. It could be funny because, as you said, that these are nice, we're like paratroopers at night, and I thought the way that your imagination brought that forth or the way you told it was a very imaginative way.
Speaker 3:Yeah so you, I think, from the storytelling aspect it's, it's something that gets practiced over the years and you get good at it. Also, it seems to be a family trait and I don't know if it's because of the conversation level of so many people or the need to get attention to tell your story so somebody actually listens. I don't know, but I've always enjoyed telling those stories, stories. And then my uh, my wife, emily, said one. She had a very serious, loving talk to me to say you know, you've been threatening about writing this book. Um, I want, I want to encourage you to take it seriously and and and do this.
Speaker 3:So I started the next day and I dedicated the first four hours of every day to writing and I had lots of notes. I had lots of notes but I didn't know what the structure was going to be. And you know, was it going to be. I wanted to tell the good bad parents understand that there are characteristics that will build strength and faith and a strong spine that can overcome adversity. So to get help with that, in the middle of that process I started seeking help and advice from professional mental health experts. So, lee, you were one of those in the middle of the book, I mean you. I found you about three quarters through the way and you became one of the resources, but you were. You were very different. There were.
Speaker 3:I talked to 18 therapists, paid for their sessions, multiple sessions for them to understand my story and for them to decide if they wanted to collaborate to help reflect on these stories so that someone could learn from it and also find out why did some of us survive and thrive and why did some of us stumble. So the reaction was the same from all of them except you. So I continued to talk to you and also I was going to ask why the 18. Also, the well, I stopped. I stopped, actually when I found um, when I found Kristen Kristen is a is a therapist who I found her profile that she specializes in in trauma recovery.
Speaker 3:She focuses on children Um, she seemed to have a lot of of what I was looking for, so I had three or four sessions with her I was looking for. So I had three or four sessions with her. All the other professionals were troubled from my past and wanted to treat me and believed I was suppressing and that I was quite damaged. Because they said what you and your siblings have experienced is complex childhood trauma, and they use the name that same term across a number of individuals. That complex while I looked it up, well, it's kind of chronic childhood trauma. If you think of the ACEs scorecard, it's if you have four or more ACEs you are categorized as.
Speaker 2:And for clarity. Aces are adverse childhood experiences.
Speaker 3:Yes, so it's a term for childhood trauma. Some call it toxic stress, some call it abuse, but I guess the professional community focuses on ACEs. So when they hear the stories and the stories of Mousetrap Gloves, which is Chapter 2 in the book, mousetail Gloves, which is chapter two in the book, it's, I think, a very interesting, loving story about my sister and I. Because we wanted gloves, our hands were cold. Kids in the neighborhood had rabbit fur gloves. We had an idea we had a mouse-infested house, so let's do it. Well, the therapist, the psychiatrist, the heavy hitters came in and said let's just unpack that. That wasn't fun, that wasn't happiness, that was desperation. You had nothing else in the freezer and that's why your mother allowed you to put the frozen mice in there. Can you imagine those two young kids working?
Speaker 2:So your experience was all the mental health professionals where their lens was simply negative.
Speaker 3:You felt like there it was. Well, it caused a downward spiral for me. I said, oh, I need to understand what this is, I need to, I need to teach myself on what this is. So I read every book I could get my hands on on the subject of trauma recovery, childhood trauma, attachment, by all the names you know and the people books I'm sure you've read, but also found you and Kristen, who I don't think you've met, but she wrote the forward to my book based on her perspective. Her perspective is very similar to yours. It was.
Speaker 3:These are beautiful stories of redemption. These are stories that people can learn from. There's the combination of the love of a mother and the teachings and the brutality and the wrong lessons taught by a father and how those things came together and caused some devastation and destruction. But it also created some beauty, and maybe this book is part of that beauty, of that beauty. So I, in this spiral, I I was becoming depressed. Here's what I found in the research all, all things that you know and this is, this is your life. But I found that there are two thirds of the adults in the United States, which I now found is replicable across all countries, two thirds of the people in the United States, which I now found is replicable across all countries. Two-thirds of the people in the United States, the adults, are suffering from the impact of childhood trauma at some level, and it's a wide spectrum from the impact to them would be mild agitation, anger, agitation, anger, anxiety, all the way to suicide because they just can't take it.
Speaker 3:Found that when a child experiences trauma, everything changes. Their brain chemistry changes, their body gets flooded with cortisol. Is that the right? Yeah, cortisol. They go into the survival mode. That constant, that constant flood of those hormones can destroy your organs. And that, if you, it surely ages. You, yeah, it's just it's so heavy and it still is. And if you have experienced four or more ACEs, so, as an example, an ace is you were neglected, you were beaten, you had, you had mental illness and one of the parents or addictions, and there's 10 of those things called aces. If you have four or more of those, you will die on average 20 years too early.
Speaker 3:And without intervention, without healing, without a healing. And you think about the travesty of that and I have, I've lost. Of the nine boys, three have died, two from drug overdoses of heroin and one from early colon cancer. That came about when he was 36 years old and the experts say you don't even need to be tested until you're 50. So I found that brain chemistry changes which erupts into mental disorders later in life if not treated, and that the body there's a book, the Body Keeps the Score. Such a great title is that it causes health destruction in diabetes, obesity, copd, cancer, heart disease Number one killer in the United States begins from that. So I found this overwhelming sadness. And then I find the prevalence. There's two thirds, that's 200 million people in the United States alone. It's over 2 billion people in the world are suffering and 40% of them will die 20 years too soon if they don't get treatment.
Speaker 3:So I went into a funk like I've never experienced in my life before. My loving wife Emily gently grabbed me and said it's time you get out of that hole. You've dug yourself a hole, mike. You need to come out, you need to come out. And she was in that encouragement. I got out of the hole, brushed myself off psychologically, and this vision came of my young self, my young Mike, maybe 10 years old, saying it's all going to be okay. It's going to be okay, and I wasn't. Up until that point I didn't reflect on my childhood as being bad or troubling. They said let's go in the house. So he walked me, young Mike, walked me through that May Avenue house and all the stories came back. And they came back in a much richer way, much more vivid. They were the same stories but everything was okay. So I rushed to finish that book.
Speaker 2:The beauty of what you're describing young mind, taking you through and re-experiencing those stories. We walk through a version of this in narrative therapy, where we go back and look through the eyes of our younger self. We also have we look at it through the eyes of our older self as well, watching our younger self experience that, and it gives us perspective, a different perspective. Yeah, because it gives us, uh, the ability to look at it as of wait, I was only 10 experiencing that. I put my in your case, my 73 year old eyes on that, thinking I was still experiencing that. And that's where that trauma keeps replaying. Right, because we think it keeps happening to us. But when we experience it as a in your case, a 73 year old man watching a 10 year old boy go through that, then we have a different perspective on it and it gives us space to do some really beautiful work.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and it sounds like, and you know that wasn't by accident. I know it was the hand of God. I didn't have a therapist or an expert who could take me through that, that, that exercise of that process it was, it was. You know, I start every writing session with a search for a passage of Scripture that will inform my writing for that day. But what I heard God saying was give it, give everyone to me, give everything to me so that release. You know what did I do? I wanted to write a memoir for my children's sake.
Speaker 3:But but that process of going back in and actually having an ex and being escorted through that house by my little self looking at me and telling me it's okay and I even knew then that it was okay. I knew I had to take care of myself. I had to take care of my siblings and my dad's teachings. My dad's parenting created badass sons and that was used for destruction until we found the Lord. I was brought to Jesus by my brother, jamie, when I was 19. And fighting and destruction was seen very quickly by us as we come to age and are reborn. But we don't want to hurt people.
Speaker 2:We don't want to hurt people there's a thread through every story in your book is you don't want to hurt people. That's not who the Menards were, I understand that's who your father taught you all to be, but it's also it seemed to me that it was a lot of his fear. That was about making sure that you never let somebody see you sweat.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah I, I think. I think that you hit the nail right on the head and you know if you wanted to talk to dad, the only time you'd get time with dad is if you're recounting a brutal fight that you just won or you're asking for help on how to damage somebody, and so that was the only time we talked was around boxing or fighting we know what we certainly know every child looks for some sort of acceptance or uh from their father of course, of course, looking for that, of course that I call it big bear cub.
Speaker 2:You you know big bear cub paw, I mean big bear paw on little bear cub head. We're looking for our father's acceptance. We want their attention. We're looking for that attachment. Yeah, yeah, and that's a hard theme to weave out of is. The only way I got any kind of affirmation from him was it had to involve some sort of brutality.
Speaker 3:Yeah, or something that I just put in the category of being wrong. You know, and I used to use, I used to say bad or evil, but it was just, it was just wrong. So you know, he one of the stories in the book is is is how he had taught me when I was 12 to steal steaks from the restaurant I worked at so that he and I could have steak when he came off the night shift at midnight. So a couple times a week he and I were sitting there having our New York strip steak, which we've never tasted before. I got time with dad. I got time with dad, which we've never tasted before. I got time with dad, I got time with dad. So that's kind of the genesis of of how the book came about.
Speaker 3:These stories became, um, richer through the visualization of going back. Some healing, I think, even took place. I'm sharing all of this with my siblings, Um, and so I wanted to get, as I found, the travesty of childhood trauma, the depth, the destruction. I wanted to get this book finished. It's not a, it's not a self-help. It's a collection of stories that are giving some people insight into their own, their own stories, and I offer reflection at the end of each story. But I wanted to get this book out because I now have a um, an obsession with doing something, with the knowledge that I've, that I've gained about the, the destruction of childhood trauma and the prevalence of it. Those two things together to me, says it's a crisis, it's a, it's, it's an epidemic, a pandemic, and that it's silent. You know there's pockets like your organization that are doing great help for how many people. You know the people in Fort Worth are around and now you're reaching out further through messages like this. But it's a huge problem that needs a huge solution.
Speaker 2:It is and it does, and I think what you're sharing is that there's a sense of attachment that's necessary. There's a sense of relationship that is healing that even beyond the couch, because you, you worked on the hurt that all of these therapists that you were visiting with, that you were saying, let me just get perspective on this. That they were saying, wait a minute perspective, but I want to talk to you, make sure you're okay. But that sent you into a position where you were looking at yourself saying, oh my gosh, are there things that I need to consider? And then you walk through your story and you reconnected to your younger self, which is really critical to that healing process. That's exactly what happened.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So, and I agree, I I hope, I hope and I pray that everybody listening that, if anybody's been through any type one adverse childhood experience, that they have the ability to wear with all the, the collection, the community, that they need to walk through that and they have the ability to find that you know that they know how to show up in their own space. Yeah, I'm.
Speaker 3:I'm hoping that anyone who reads the book or listens to this podcast understands you're not alone. You are not alone. This was not your fault. This happened to you. You may understand it, you may not, but I'm hoping that the book and messages like this will open eyes to the possibility and to understand or seek an understanding of why do I have relationship problems, why do I have a obsession with food, what habits do I have that are unhealthy, that are soothing me, that are damaging me, and get to get to the root of that.
Speaker 2:I love what you're saying, that that why do I have an obsession with whatever? It is that is damaging me, and I hope that that our listeners and that we'll all consider that. What it's damaging is the sense that it's keeping me away from connection. Yes, I'm seeking this over connection. Yes, and for some it's work, for some it's food, for some it's sex, for some it's online social media, different things. For some it may even be this spiritual idea and they may think it's so great, wonderful, but it keeps them from connecting to a community. Community and that's, I think, if man, if anybody walks away with from this, with one with two things buy mike's book, read this book, it's amazing. And number two is that relationship is at the core of human, it's in the core of human and that's what you're, that's what I love about what you, what you bring out in the book. And I curious, would you be open to telling us why the title is the Titan Couldn't Fly?
Speaker 3:I would be happy to, because it's my favorite story and I think it's the richest story. It's got the most to offer and I'm very proud of that story. So let me, let me try to tell it quickly. So imagine that home 900 square foot, no money. Um, you learn a very powerful lesson from all of this is that there is some magic with the combination of scarcity and gratitude.
Speaker 2:Say that again. That's brilliant.
Speaker 3:Yeah, one of the reflections was that I did without, we had nothing. And there's a magic that happens with the combination of scarcity meaning the lack of things and a gracious heart. The Lord loves a thankful heart. If you have gratitude and graciousness, you don't expect much and you're happy with what you get. So not having was not as disastrous as you would think, because my mother taught gratitude she, boy did she?
Speaker 2:and I'm sorry to interrupt you, but boy did she. And the interesting thing about gratitude is it's like when I was saying earlier the lens through which you tell many of your stories could shift the way one experiences it If you tell it through a different lens. Of course you were telling the mitten story through the lens of the gratitude that there were so many mice for y'all to choose from.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah and they were pretty because we were going to have these beautiful bugs yeah, you weren't telling it through the lens of. Well, they're not rabbits and I know. And again, I'm not saying that you need to put lipstick on something that is that is horrible Lipstick on a pig. I don't even want to say that. I'm not. I'm not suggesting that that if you just have gratitude that it'll fill your belly when you're starving, that's not what either of us are saying. There is a certain perspective that you were taught. That was there was a sense of magic that I think plays into your adult life too. But we'll get there.
Speaker 3:So a child, you know we didn't want for much because we we knew it was futile to desire. So you just, you know it's a bit sad when you say I give up on wanting that, but we we learned that longing for things we were not going to get was not productive, was not healthy. So let's be happy with what we have. So I'm going to tell a story about another. The opening chapter is a story called we have a Light Bulb and in that 900 square foot home back then this is the 50s the way you got light bulbs is you paid your electric bill and depending on how much money you paid on the light bill, they gave you light bulbs. You couldn't go to the store and buy a light bulb. So because we were always late with our payment on electricity and some of us didn't pay the bill, we didn't get light bulbs, but we always seemed to have one. There was always. We were never without a light bulb, but I remember us always having one and my mom would put that in the center of the kitchen and that's where we would do our homework, on the floor and and that's where we'd, you know, eat our meal and then, when it came time to go upstairs to the attic, which was the dormitory half boys, half girls she would say, okay, gather around. And we'd all get around her like little chickens and she'd grab her apron dirty apron, raise up and hot light bulb, you know. And as we were shuffling to the stairs to go upstairs, she would be preaching to us, teaching us we have a light bulb. Do you know how many children don't have a light bulb? Do you know how lucky we are to have a light bulb? Yeah, we go upstairs and put the light bulb in for the night. Everybody gets settled. She took the light bulb out and bring it back downstairs for the for the next day. So learning, you know. She could have said I wish we had more light bulbs. You know, I wish your father made more money. I just she could. She could make it, like many do, many parents do, but she used it as a blessings, and so we are thankful for everything we get. So as a child, I wanted three things. I remember this. I wanted three things. I remember this. I wanted a trophy, don't know why, maybe just a recognition of I'm worth something right. I wanted a baseball glove to play Little League baseball and I wanted this Black Panther lamp that had green eyes, jewels as his eyes, that was in the corner store, corner window at Kresge's, which ended up being K marked. So I was bugging my mom and she's finally said you want, do you want to? You want to win a trophy? The grand contest, the great kite contest, is next week. Let's build a kite to win a trophy. They give trophies away, yeah.
Speaker 3:So at night I had to cut some lawns to get money to buy crayons, got got a big box of 64 color crayons. She went down to the butcher shop and got butcher paper. My dad made a big frame out of two by fours. You know right away, if it's built out of two by fours it's not going to fly. So she drew a picture of Jacob's ladder, the vision of Jacob's ladder, his dream that showed we do have access to heaven. She is an artist. She did a beautiful job and as we were, as she was drawing this every night it was her and I, which was a special time.
Speaker 3:If we would only do it after the others were asleep, I would help her and we would talk, and I would be asking her multiple times each night where are we going to put that trophy and she'd say right on the top of the television so that everybody, the neighbors can see it and we can see it. She didn't say you might not win that trophy. I mean, it was a done deal. I was going to win a trophy. Well, I get to the contest and I try to fly the kite. I won't fly and I'm a little chubby boy. Now I'm a big chubby boy but I was a little chubby boy and I would run and throw nothing. And I had visions that I was going to win that trophy and I was going to actually be flying on top of my kite holding my trophy, and you know, kids want to fly.
Speaker 3:So I finally resigned myself to the fact that there wasn't going to be a, there was not going to be a trophy because it either had to fly the highest, the most aerobatic, or be the smallest kite that could fly, and I didn't have any of that criteria. So I set my kite up on a tree and it drew a crowd because of the beauty of the kite and I was preaching. You know, I was talking about Jesus and salvation and the road to heaven, and that must have struck a chord in some people. So when it came time to announce the trophies. I won first prize and it was a new category for creativity and it was a four-foot-high trophy. So there's a lot of messages there. There's a paradox. The reason I put it as the title is that can a kite that doesn't fly win first prize? Most people would say no. Well, it did. Can a boy raised in poverty and with childhood trauma become a successful God-loving man? Most people would say no, but I am.
Speaker 2:So it's kind of a symbolism and a paradox of believing in something that generally won't happen yeah, and when I think about thank you for telling that story, um, I love, I've heard you tell it a couple of times and every time I hear it, I just it. It's one of my favorites. Thank you, lee. Um, you know, I think about, even think about what, what you're saying, and how a kite that couldn't fly, how the world is not going to win the four-foot trophy, and a young man who grows up in some very traumatic experiences, how does he flourish?
Speaker 2:And I think about, I mean, one of the things that I'm grateful to you for, that I didn't know. I should be grateful to you for 20 years ago. I was really grateful to you and I didn't know you because you invented the disposable diaper. Yes, and I would say that all of us parents who are any of you who have had to change a diaper and don't use cloth diapers, we're to mike menard it's a strange thing for being famous for parents are in the us, in the world, but it's, but it's, yeah, it's all part of the the story, right, it's all part of the story, yeah, and so you know it's like you.
Speaker 2:You going from this, this experience as a child and as a young man you know, and the more that I've thought about this, thought about your career with johnson and johnson and thought about your career with all of your inventions. I think you said you had 15, 15, yeah and uh, you know those, those, those are all. All 15 of them are about ingenuity, about to me when I, when I understood all your patents, I I look at that story again of the of the mice parachuting down and you're looking at it and some kids would look, some people would look at that and say we have a mouse infested house. I hate it, I don't know what to make of it. This is is so gross, it's so, this, it's so that you looked at it and said there's a problem, I see a solution and they're going to come together.
Speaker 3:Now, that's, that's the. That's the epicenter of innovation, problem potential, solution or need, and that's the aha moment. So when you grow up in an environment that encourages it and you get to meet or link up need with opportunity, uh, and you learn to generate those ideas and bring them to life, it's a real gift, it's, it's a real gift, it's, it's a real gift. So, um, it's, it has served me well. I also there's. You know, there's the.
Speaker 3:That idea was, I would say, a fluke. You know, I I it came because I was babysitting a, babysitting my youngest brother. I was 17 at the at the time and he was. He had a couple of bowel movements that leaked out onto me through the cloth diaper and I had the idea to make a make one out of paper towels and flush it and gave that idea to my dad, told, told him the idea. He saw the brilliance, went to a patent attorney and we piled, filed a patent memo to secure the idea, ended up selling that patent, excuse me, or assigning the rights of the patent to Johnson Johnson.
Speaker 3:And then they started treating me like I was an inventor and started presenting problems and I would come up with solutions and if you had resources around you generating, it becomes pretty easy to be a genius. You've got people supporting you and handing all the legal stuff around patenting and so it became part of my career and part of my life and part of my testimony. I have the opportunity in my second life, second career, I founded a software company. I still own that company. It also teaches organizations on how to optimize their allocation of resources. But I walk into those boardrooms already kind of a rock star in the innovation world. So it helps the entree and it again served the purpose.
Speaker 2:And any parent in that room is, is you're immediately yes.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Because you solved a big problem for us, for me, that I didn't know, that I had. Yeah, you know. So that makes that makes a lot of sense. And even in creating the software there's an invented, there's an inventiveness that you are offering to companies to find, because at the core of the software, your software is finding.
Speaker 3:It is aligning, it is optimizing the allocation of resources to the things that will bring the greatest good based on your strategy. So it's a mouthful, but that's what every executive wants to do Optimize the allocation of resources to generate the best good. And I am quite confident that all of that coming before me was coming to apply to this next problem that I discovered by writing my memoir, which is what I want to do now is marshal resources and optimize the allocation of those resources to the things that are going to have the greatest impact on healing people from childhood trauma and stopping childhood trauma. Yes, you know the prevention side, go upstream, I think you said. You know, clean the stream, stop the pollution. Right now the creek is polluted. We have to heal the people that are sick from drinking that water. We have to clean up the creek so people don't get sick from drinking it. So I think it's a beautiful analogy that you used at that meeting we had a couple weeks ago.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that there's just a holistic space here that we have to figure out how people can act toward helping heal relationship. We are a divided nation and we divide on arbitrary. Some are arbitrary, Some are very meaningful spaces. But even in the meaningful spaces we can disagree and stay connected. And I think that's the difficulty that we face currently is is how do we stay connected even in a disagreement? But it takes an understanding of how we attach. It takes an understanding of how can we stay connected. I think our call to action is let's stand united through helping heal childhood trauma, and I think there's a distinct call to action here.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I have this visual of if you could collect all the tears from all the people in the universe and put them into vats, what would you label them? What would? Where would the tear? Where are the tears coming from? And what I see, what I hear, is that if you could label them, it would say a couple of things. I'm alone. It would say unloved, right, and why? How is that happening? How is that happening? And you know it's. I've always felt that, that pull, that pain of humanity, but really couldn't get my arms around it. But now I'm starting to, all because of making the decision to tell my story. And it's about. It's not about well, I hope you enjoy the stories, but it really is about how it transformed my thinking to what's next. So if you can get some benefit and if you can enjoy the book and I hope you do that's great. But for me it's a springboard and maybe it can be a spearhead to the movement of at least raising awareness to the, to the, the devastation and the prevalence of of childhood trauma.
Speaker 2:Yes, there's a quote in your book that I would love for you to read to us about the rumblings that you've experienced.
Speaker 3:Yes, Turned right to the page. How did that happen?
Speaker 2:We call it the holy flop.
Speaker 3:The holy flop. For those of you who are reading along, I'm joking this is on page 162. Our job is not to deny the story, but to defy the ending, to rise strong, recognize our story and rumble with the truth until we get to a place where we can think, yes, this is what happened, this is my truth and I will choose how the story ends. So encouragement to all of you. I think you. Why don't you say how?
Speaker 2:you said it's not about the beginning, it's. Cs lewis has a great quote that is very similar to what you wrote. He said you cannot go back and change the ending, but you can start right where you are and you can change the ending. Yeah, yeah, and that's one of my favorite things that she wrote Because we can't do anything about the past, we certainly can decide how we'd like to take the present and deal, do our work, deal with the hard things, and I'm not asking you to, I'm not suggesting that one would do that alone.
Speaker 2:You need, we need community. I desperately would do that alone. We need community. I desperately need community. We all desperately need community and as we walk out these things and themes that we have been through in our life, that we would find ourselves a little more whole every time we walk through. Yes, we have scars. I had a young man ask me just a few days ago can I heal from trauma? And I said, yes, you can heal to a point that. Or he said, can I get over my trauma? And I said you can heal to a point that you're managing the impacts of trauma on you. No, you can never take away the scars, they're always there. But yes, we can get to a point where we manage what we've been through.
Speaker 3:And for those of you who and by the numbers it's going to be about 65% of the listeners who are suffering or suffering from maybe you don't even know what you're suffering from, but understand that it need not be a life sentence Healing, the promise of healing is there and it works, and there's not just one answer to it. But you need to start by stepping over the line to the commitment of healing, and that magic will happen when you step across that line and find you'll find the ways to, to, to find the resources and the education and the professionals that can help you heal.
Speaker 2:And this is the message from beyond the couch You're not imploring people to just find a therapist Right. You're saying find yourself.
Speaker 3:Yeah, find yourself. I'm hearing, prompted by the book, that if you can make the space for a conversation on the topic with someone you trust and love, again magic begins to happen. It's a release, it's an acknowledgement, and with someone who you trust and love, it's very important that it be that person and if you don't have that person in your life, make that a top priority. It's critical to your well-being and to your healing.
Speaker 2:Mike, as always getting to spend time with you as a treasure, thank you. Thank you for being on on our show and thank you for writing this book. Thank you for what you've contributed out there and, most importantly, mike, thank you for your passion. You, you, you, uh there. There's so much beauty here that you are bringing to a really dark and painful subject, so thank you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's all a surprise, but I'm I'm happy to be in this place, yeah.
Speaker 4:If you found value in our discussion and wish to uncover more about the fascinating world of mental wellness, don't forget to subscribe to the podcast. Stay tuned for our upcoming episodes, where Dr Long will continue to delve into empowering therapies and strategies for mental wellness. Your journey to understanding and embracing mental health is just beginning and we're excited to have you with us every step of the way. Until next time, keep exploring, keep growing and remember to celebrate restored freedom as you uncover it.
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